Report of the Meeting Held Monday, 8th January 2018

Minutes of a meeting of the board of directors of the Company held at BBPA Offices, Brewers’ Hall, Aldermanbury Square, London, EC2V 7HR on Monday, 8th January 2018 at 12:30 pm

Present:                                                                                                                  Apologies:

Sir Peter Luff (Chairman) – (SPL)                                                                              Bill Sharpe (BS)

Mike Clist – (MC)                                                                                                          Nick Griffin (NG)

Brigid Simmonds – (BS)                                                                                              Martin Caffrey (MCa)

James Anderson (JA)

Kate Nicholls – (KN)

Jim Cathcart – (JC)

Chris Welham (CW)

George Barnes (GB)

Sue Allen (SA)

Fiona Moran – (FM)




The Chairman noted that the meeting had been duly convened, that a quorum of five directors was present in accordance with the Articles of Association and declared the meeting open.

2. Minutes of the last meeting 16th October 2017

The Chair proceeded with the meeting by requesting that the minutes of the meeting held on 16th October 2017 be proposed as a true and accurate record of the discussions that took place.  The Board approved the minutes.

3.PGB Accounts

  • MC circulated the accounts for the period 01/08/2017 – 31/12/2017.
  • MC advised the Board that the accounts are in a good place, the company subscription fee had  been reduced to £16, but should pub numbers covered by the Code reduce, this might have to be increased. No decision needs to be made before the summer, MC to bring proposal for subscription fees for discussion at the next meeting.
  • Consultancy costs could increase depending on future PICAS cases. One Company invoice outstanding – BS asked for a copy of the invoice to chase payment.  After note: Payment has now been received.


Outstanding Invoice to be sent to BS – FM to send copy

Proposal for Subscription fees – MC to bring to next meeting


4.PICA-Service update of cases

  • FM advised the Board that the database shows all enquiries received since the last PGB meeting. There are six open cases. Conflict of interest was recorded by JA and one Director should one of the cases result in a PICAS case.
  • One case heard resulted in favour of the pub company concerned.

5.PIRRS case update

  • FM gave an update on the open PIRRS Cases.
  • 9 active cases, 8 of which are with the Independent Experts, one pub has an outstanding VAT payment which is payable before documentation is forwarded to the Independent Expert. Post Mtg note the pub concerned has paid the VAT outstanding and the case can proceed.
  • GB enquired about the time it takes the Independent Expert to rule on a case. KN suggested including on the database a column indicating the deadline date(9 months after it has been with the Independent Expert)  and a further column with the Independent Expert comments.  FM to put pressure on the Independent Experts and report back to PGB Board.


Update the PIRRS database with two extra columns for Independent Expert comments. FM – to update.


6.Reporting System – Helpline Enquiries

  • MC informed the board that there are 40-50 calls on a monthly basis and commented that only the important ones are included on the database MC commented that we are now making a note of all calls received through the PGB helpline.


7.Update on Press releases for the Over 500 companies and PICAS Scottish Panel

  • JC gave an overview of the over 500 companies using PIRRS, and confirmed that on the 9th November 2017 the press release had been circulated to all media contacts and the PIRRS website updated by FM. The PCA also included the press release in their regulatory bulletin in December.
  • JC circulated a draft copy of the PICAS Scottish Panel Press release which is to be sent to trade media, JC asked for comments and feedback. JC confirmed that FM had updated the PICAS website with the Scottish Panel.
  • MC informed the board that he had sent a copy to officials in Scotland but had not received any comment back.
  • BS raised the question received from MCa around PICAS for the over 500 companies, there was a discussion held, BS commented that she thought it unlikely, given the overlay of statutory legislation that this could be agreed. MC commented that the PCA need to be acting and there needs to be more pressure put on the PCA to deal with these queries,- MC is meeting the PCA on Thursday (11/01/18) and will discuss.


Finalise the PICAS Scottish Panel Press release and circulate – JC


8.Draft for the Practical and legal issues to Kite Mark Companies with agreements operating within the under 500 code

  • JC held a discussion around the Kite Marking draft proposal which would allow companies to promote their sign-up to the Code operated by the PGB. The Board discussed in what circumstances companies could be asked to remove the Kite Mark. The Board agreed that if their performance reported in the annual survey was unsatisfactory the PGB could warn the company and if necessary remove the Kite Mark from them.
  • MC recommended PEAT be changed to mention that it is safer to take a lease or tenancy from companies signed up to the 1-499 pub codes.
  • BS suggested that the Kite Mark should appear on company websites, marketing literature and made available to potential tenants.



JC to draft proposal and to discuss further at the next PGB meeting.


9.Annual Audit and Press Release

  • JC circulated the draft Annual Audit report for 21st July 2016 – 31st July 2017. This is the first audit to take place since the new codes of practice came into effect. The information was taken from MC’s spreadsheet and collated into a report. JC requested comments and feedback.
  • MC requested under “Code Compliance” the 2nd line to be removed and also for a comment to be made under BDM training. CW commented that many companies have senior people doing the role of a BDM, and MC suggested including the comment “small companies find it difficult to put training courses together”. Item 10 discussed the development of greater provision of BDM training.
  • KN – suggested creating a chart to show the companies who are not signed up to the code that perhaps should be.
  • CW commented that the report is very factual, and doesn’t make any recommendations and would suggest stating “good set of results”



JC to amend and update the annual audit to include Recommendations/comments from the board.


10.BDM Presentation – Sue Allen

  • SA presented the BDM Presentation to the board – (copy attached). A discussion was held around the lack of availability of courses and trainers available, especially within the smaller companies, more clarity is needed from the industry as to what level of training is appropriate.  
  • SA provided a list of names for a working party and it was agreed by the board to start work on this immediately, BS and KN also offered their support and a member of their operations team to be included. CW commented that it would be good to include tenants in the working party and MC suggested approaching LOYA winners.
  • There was a discussion held around the type of training and level to be provided, KN suggested the apprenticeship framework which allows a mixture of practical and theory and it was agreed it would be discussed further at the next PGB meeting.


11. AOB

  • MC informed the board that one company’s Scottish Code of Practice stated that tenants could use PICAS on a TAW agreement; this clause has now been removed.
  • MC gave an overview to the board the hearing cost of the PICAS case that took place on 26th October 2017. 


 12.Next PGB Meeting

Monday, 21st May 2018 – 12:30pm – 2.30 pm

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